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05:22 <HazWard> Hi, I've successfully installed a Alpine chroot on my phone bit I was wondering what package I have to install to use adduser or useradd?
05:34 <HazWard> b
05:36 <avih> HazWard: adduser is busybox, and i _think_ for useradd you need the package "shadow"
05:38 <HazWard> I just realized I forgot to modify my $PATH
05:38 <HazWard> avih: I have access to adduser now
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10:59 <hiro> avih: looked at images finally
10:59 <hiro> avih: seems like a real keyboard
10:59 <hiro> avih: i can imagine that being better than my phone :)
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11:09 <avih> hiro: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtWSqJToN6I :)
11:12 <avih> it's indeed a very real kb, albeit a small one :)
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12:14 <^7heo> at least you're not a troll.
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12:17 <^7heo> avih: any OS that runs on this machine?
12:18 <^7heo> (other than the stock)
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12:41 <HazWard> when running "su" in my alpine chroot I get this error: su can't set groups Connection refused. The root user is the owner and has r,w,x rights in this file. Did I break something? Also when I start sshd, it shows initgroup on the client but then I lose connection
12:57 <hiro> ^7heo: a troll?
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12:58 <^7heo> hiro: sorry, it took me time to realize I was answering to a quit message.
12:58 <^7heo> peckac happens obviously.
12:59 <hiro> ^7heo: ahaha, i don't see them
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12:59 <hiro> avih: good video. i like that it has cursor keys also
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12:59 <hiro> nowadays it might be worth putting an e-ink display on this kind of device
13:00 <hiro> i want a greyscale computer
13:00 <^7heo> why?
13:00 <^7heo> because it's more hype? :P
13:00 <hiro> no, people waste too much time with images
13:00 <^7heo> hiro: basically the quit message wrapped around at a point that looked to me like a nick, and a message.
13:00 <^7heo> images are important too.
13:01 <^7heo> there's not only text.
13:01 <hiro> when i get google talk messages from friends i always respond i can't open images
13:01 <hiro> cause it gets relayed to irc for me
13:01 <hiro> and the image link is always to some google plus shit that you need to log in and make a google+ account first to see it
13:01 <hiro> when people want to write me sms it doesn't work cause i have a landline. so they can write a letter, mail or irc message instead :P
13:02 <^7heo> yeah, I don't use google talk
13:02 <hiro> i also accept phone calls
13:02 <^7heo> problem solved.
13:02 <hiro> i only use google talk because it's built into bitlbee
13:02 <hiro> and bitlbee is still installed from the time where people insisted in talking via icq/msn/aim
13:02 <c00kiemon5ter> is google-talk the same as hangouts?
13:02 <^7heo> you can use skype with bitlbee too...
13:02 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: yes
13:02 <hiro> ^7heo: might be, i had once set it up in my freeswitch
13:02 <hiro> ^7heo: but they fucked it up, so i gave up on skype, too.
13:02 <c00kiemon5ter> can you have otr on top of that?
13:03 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: i do have otr on top of anything in irc
13:03 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: there's irssi-otr
13:03 <c00kiemon5ter> yep, but there's no my-irc-client-otr yet :P
13:03 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: if people write me google talk messages with irssi-otr it's encrypted
13:03 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: i haven't mentioned the bitlbee otr plugin, because plainly it sucks ass
13:04 <c00kiemon5ter> is google-talk still jabber/xmpp?
13:04 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: but it exists
13:04 <c00kiemon5ter> yes, I use it from time to time over jabber
13:04 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: i interface with googletalk/hangout people via jabber, yes
13:04 <c00kiemon5ter> good to know, thanks
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13:05 <hiro> i quite like that people have to figure out a way to reach me that doesn't involve any of that modern fad bullshit
13:05 <hiro> normally they only waste time with their sms/whatsupp messages anyway
13:05 <c00kiemon5ter> has anyone looked into apps like riot.im , the matrix protocol, signal and all the things around it.. ?
13:05 <hiro> cause they are bored in public transport or something
13:05 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: i don't use apps.
13:06 <hiro> for a time while my x61 was broken i used a kindle as my main computer.
13:06 <hiro> i felt so much more productive.
13:06 <hiro> i learned shit, by reading plaintext, high-quality information
13:06 <c00kiemon5ter> my view is that since slack got traction, the instant-im apps went through a "boom" phase, along with the snowden revelations, and everything now wants to be the next secure thing
13:06 <hiro> i think books are the best transmission format for considerable amounts of information.
13:07 <hiro> and a greyscale display limits the means to just this right format.
13:07 <c00kiemon5ter> however that fragmented things so much, that one now needs 4 apps to talk with their friends etc
13:07 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: but it's all on top of fucking android
13:07 <c00kiemon5ter> yep
13:07 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: so there's nothing secure about it
13:07 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: it's all lies.
13:07 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: they'd send letters if they wanted REAL privacy
13:07 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: but they actually prefer comfort and wasting their times
13:08 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: smartphones are fun, new, shiny and can be used to distract from their boring lifes.
13:08 <c00kiemon5ter> if you mean written letters, that's not very private, but you can always use pgp that's proven to work
13:09 <hiro> i think it's much more secure to write physical letters than trying to use pgp on a badly-administered system
13:09 <hiro> computers aren't made for privacy
13:09 <c00kiemon5ter> it's all about where you put your trust
13:09 <hiro> it's technically much more viable to save everything you send via mail
13:09 <c00kiemon5ter> ofcourse both parties need to have the same security policies for it to work
13:10 <c00kiemon5ter> secpol / threat-model
13:10 <hiro> rather than carefully opening or scanning through your letter and trying to OCR the content
13:10 <hiro> it's a matter of scale
13:10 <hiro> physical letters only protect against mass surveillence, not individual surveillence obviously
13:11 <hiro> but i think once you fear the latter you should reconsider anyway
13:11 <c00kiemon5ter> well computers as devices have the fundumental flow, that you need to trust your hardware and firmware, until we can have viable open source alternatives
13:11 <hiro> and find a much better individually adjusted security concepty
13:11 <c00kiemon5ter> comm between devices is flawed, because the net is not designed for privacy
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13:11 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: i trust that they will save all low-bitrate comms that i generate with my internet-connected devices
13:12 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: i'm sure they won't save my bittorrent traffice.
13:12 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: because of scale.
13:12 <c00kiemon5ter> there are some ideas that protect privacy, namely mixnets, though you have other problems there
13:12 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: but i also know that even a small letter with few, important and private sentences will probably not get picked out for inspection.
13:13 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: i think encryption can try to minimize the general exploitation risk
13:13 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: but it doesn't really ensure much at all.
13:13 <c00kiemon5ter> well, it depends on your threat model - if you think you're being spied then you may not make that assumption
13:14 <hiro> if you're being spied on normally you should just visit your psychologist
13:14 <c00kiemon5ter> pgp tried to solve the integrity and confidentiality problem, and it does well, but it does not hide the parties that communicate
13:14 <c00kiemon5ter> tor hides the originating party
13:14 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: pgp is pretty much unusable for the user
13:14 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: irssi-otr is how it should have been done.
13:15 <c00kiemon5ter> a mixnet tries to hide (or fuzz) the communication between two parties
13:15 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: try out the interface, it's enlightening.
13:15 <c00kiemon5ter> it all depends on what you're running away from
13:15 <c00kiemon5ter> there is no silver bullet - a one for all solution
13:15 <c00kiemon5ter> yes, pgp is pretty bad
13:15 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: there is a silver bullet for what pgp is trying to solve, and that is the interface irssi-otr presents to me.
13:15 <c00kiemon5ter> generally security interfers with comfort :/
13:16 <c00kiemon5ter> otr is nice, that's why I asked too
13:16 <hiro> otr in bitlbee sucks though, for example.
13:16 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: it has to be the right technology *and* the right interface together.
13:16 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: i'm not sure how secure OTR is technically today
13:17 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: but i get to use it a lot more in semi-secure ways (even if the other side is unverified), because it's so much easier for everybody to set up.
13:17 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: so non-nerds keep on talking *securely* to me.
13:17 <hiro> c00kiemon5ter: that's quite remarkable
13:18 <c00kiemon5ter> otr is supposed to be technically secure and viable, and forward secrecy ensures that even if you reveal a key or someone breaks a message, they must repeat the whole procedure for the next message
13:18 <hiro> yeah, i haven't read the code really.
13:18 <hiro> i don't consider anything flawless. But at least I'm quite sure this is better than all the recent hipster apps for android
13:19 <hiro> and i think it's quite conceivable that a noob installs an ubuntu with encrypted rootfs and gajim on top.
13:19 <hiro> i wish OTR was more widely used also
13:20 <hiro> for example it could work just fine via mail, too.
13:20 <hiro> you could reuse the same keys for all kinds of different transports
13:20 <c00kiemon5ter> well, for starters, it should be included and enabled by default in apps like pidgin or gajim etc
13:20 <hiro> for example if my internet breaks i could resume an OTR conversation via SMS with the same key, IF this was supported by software on all sides.
13:21 <^7heo> hiro: have you tried Tox btw?
13:21 <c00kiemon5ter> tormessenger (by the guys that do torbrowser) does that
13:21 <hiro> nope
13:21 <hiro> ^7heo: was it the web thing?
13:21 <c00kiemon5ter> iirc, tox was started by a guy from the suckless community
13:21 <c00kiemon5ter> or at least I remember talking with him on #suckless
13:22 <c00kiemon5ter> and I think tox has gotten big nowadays, it supports video chat etc
13:22 <^7heo> hiro: it's an experimental protocol, that works pretty well
13:22 <^7heo> hiro: but unfortunately requires quite some bandwith to work correctly
13:22 <c00kiemon5ter> yeah, that's the one, tox.chat
13:23 <^7heo> hiro: so on mobiles, it's really irrealistic for now.
13:28 <c00kiemon5ter> hmm, I can't find that app I was thinking -mobile app peer-to-peer and encrypted- but ricochet does that and seems to have progressed
13:29 <c00kiemon5ter> and then there's ring.cx by gnu
13:29 <c00kiemon5ter> anyway, I'm going back to work
13:29 <c00kiemon5ter> cu later o/
13:30 <^7heo> c00kiemon5ter: P2P and mobile don't mix well.
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14:04 <avih> hiro: it runs epoc, which later became symbian. iirc it could run some linux at the time but take into account that it's a 20 yo device so ram is scarce (8/16/24 depending on model) and the cpu is 18/36 Mhz. but it runs a sinclair spectrum emulator just fine :p
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14:05 <avih> (i.e. this device is where symbian came from)
14:09 <hiro> nice
14:10 <avih> ^7heo: ^ sorry. but this is by the same guy who designed the form factor and kb, apparently modern but in a similar form factor https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/gemini-pda-android-linux-keyboard-mobile-device-phone and early backers price is damn fine, if you're willing to gamble on it. supposedly first devices will ship in 2017
14:10 <hiro> the best thing on my symbian phone was the excellent voip implementation and the putty port :D
14:10 <hiro> i still haven't found something that got near to these functionalities
14:11 <kpcyrd> what's the policy to bump testing packages into releases?
14:12 <avih> hiro: it has rs232 and a terminal iirc, though at the time i didn't have anywhere specific to ssh into :)
14:12 <hiro> of course :)
14:12 <^7heo> avih: 8 what? KB?
14:12 <^7heo> avih: or MB?
14:12 <^7heo> (I hope for the latter)
14:12 <avih> 8mb ram, 18mhz cpu (arm)
14:13 <avih> later model doubled both in the same form factor (5mx)
14:13 <avih> i have a first gen psion 5
14:13 <^7heo> with 24 MB
14:13 <^7heo> there would be a way to boot a BSD on it.
14:13 <^7heo> for sure.
14:13 <^7heo> but not really X :D
14:13 <avih> i'm quite sure it was possible to boot some linux on it
14:14 <avih> http://www.adrianjwells.freeuk.com/ and http://linux-7110.sourceforge.net/
14:15 <^7heo> okay I'll check your indiegogo link
14:17 <avih> the indigogo one is modern android hw with a phone and also supports linux. and 4G ram
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14:43 <tw> Can I enable w and last in alpine? If so, how?
14:44 <pickfire> tw: procops
14:44 <pickfire> procps*
14:44 <pickfire> I don't quite like the /bin/top and /bin/free
14:45 <tw> already installed: last: couldn't open file '/dev/null/wtmp': Not a directory
14:46 <tw> Additionally, /var/log/wtmp isn't updated when users log in/out
14:46 <pickfire> Huh?
14:47 <pickfire> Mine isn't as well.
14:47 <TBB> I might be completely wrong regarding this, but ... musl issue, not supported
14:48 <pickfire> Huh?
14:48 <pickfire> How come related to musl?
14:48 <pickfire> We shouldn't just blame musl right?
14:48 <tw> Google search agrees with that assessment. Does not implement wtmp/utmp stubs.
14:48 <_ikke_> musl does not support wtmp
14:48 <_ikke_> they see it as a privacy breahc
14:48 <_ikke_> breach
14:50 <pickfire> Oh
14:50 <pickfire> Musl does not support tons of things though.
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15:14 <TBB> hm. I do remember what to do to get lspci to list device names, but not how to make lsusb do the same thing
15:14 <TBB> pciutils and hwdata-pci did the former, but hwdata-usb and usbutils didn't quite get there
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15:19 <HazWard> Hello, I've tried to find the solution to my issue but I could find anything, when I run the su command I get an error saying that I can't set groups. I used chmod and chown to set the correct permissions but nothing seems to work. Do you guys have any suggestions?
15:19 <lesion> you're inside a container without the right capabilities ?
15:22 <pickfire> Haha
15:22 <pickfire> HazWard: Blame grsec
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15:23 <yGweSm1OzVHe> echo 0 >/proc/sys/kernel/grsecurity/chroot_deny_chmod
15:24 <yGweSm1OzVHe> ^^^^ HazWard do this outside the chroot
15:26 <pickfire> HazWard: If you want to keep it persistant.
15:26 <pickfire> Write something like grsec.chroot_deny_chmod=0 in /etc/sysctl.conf or /etc/sysctl.d/local.conf
15:36 <HazWard> oh ok pickfire and yGweSm1OzVHe, I added a file for sysctl and I rebooted my device, I'll try to enter the chroot and use su
15:37 <pickfire> Oh gg
15:38 <pickfire> HazWard: kernel.grsecurity.chroot_deny_chmod = 0
15:38 <pickfire> Sorry
15:38 <pickfire> I set that in /etc/sysctl.d/10-lxc.conf
15:38 <pickfire> Well, it can be switched on the fly by
15:38 <pickfire> sysctl -w kernel.grsecurity.chroot_deny_chmod=0
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16:06 <yGweSm1OzVHe> naja keeping this persistent is not a good idea makes breaking out of chroots much easier
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16:29 <pickfire> How do I create a package that allows me to be either depend on python2 or python3?
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16:48 <welshjf> <@_ikke_> they see it as a privacy breahc << more like unnecessary security exposure if I recall; non-root processes having to write to common log file
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18:38 <Peasant65> Does anyone know how I can compile a go app for musl under ubuntu ?
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18:40 <Peasant65> I 2 identical arm boxes, one running ubu and one alpine. The ubuntu one has golang installed (because I´m too lazy to compile golang for alpine). Now I want to compile a go app for arm+musl instead of libc. I allready have musl.musl-tools and musl-dev installed
18:41 <scv> golang isn't in the alpine/arm repos?
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18:49 <dalias> glibc*
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18:59 <Huck777> hi, I'm trying to run backuppc, but it always fails with this error "Unescaped left brace in regex is deprecated, passed through in regex; marked by". It seems to be the same bug like this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/backuppc/+bug/1570987
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19:59 <steffen9k> Peasant65, go is available in edge
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22:40 <magnusgraviti> Hi!
22:40 <magnusgraviti> How to build vmlinuz from alpine if I want to package it with one my app?
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